The grace vs. works debate rages on, but I really believe most of us are on the same side; we just don’t realize it. Our terms get confused.

For instance, you automatically equated faith with trust. Some define faith to be a belief in the existence of something. I think you would agree that merely believing in Jesus’ existence is insufficient for salvation. There are a variety of ways to interpret the phrase, “saved by grace through faith.”

I personally find the grace/works debate unhelpful in its current state, precisely because of the confusion in terms. Check out another post on the restoration’s unique atonement doctrine. I’ll quote briefly:

“…[Some] mistakenly think our Church is moving toward an understanding of the relationship between grace and works that draws on Protestant teachings.”

I would balance my statement by saying that salvation is by grace through faith. Since faith is trust then it should show in how we live our lives, but the fruit of trusting is not pre-requisite to salvation.

Also, to RTC – to know and to prove something are two different things. This is one of the reasons why post-modernism has taken a hold on our culture – we have equated knowing something with proving it is true. However, knowledge is believing something to be true and it actually being true. Proving something to be true is nearly impossible. You cannot even prove to me that you ate what you did for your last meal. There will always be other plausible reasons or excuses for the evidence you provide. However, that does not mean that reason is out of the picture. We must make the most reasonable choice we can. And I am not sure that believing that Jesus never existed is a very reasonable choice, historians inside and outside of the church testify of his existence. Whether you believe he did what the gospels say he did is another question, but to deny his existence is quite frankly a little silly.

But back to reason… I am still waiting for a Mormon to debunk my paper I wrote on the Mormon fallacy of having eternal progression and an omnipotent god. You can download it at my site: Highways to Zion

The rough part about Mormonism is that you have to swallow all the stuff that the prophets speak prophetically about. And they have said some pretty crazy, and not to mention contradictory, things. However with Orthodox Christianity you have a simple gospel and the freedom to disagree with the highest positioned person in the church. But with Mormonism everything hinges on this guy named Joseph Smith – not Jesus. It all stands or falls based on Joseph Smith, not Jesus.

I really appreciate this blog’s efforts to educate. I look forward to reading more.

It is not difficult to understand why Mormons believe Grace is more earned than received when you read the third Article of faith (“may be saved through obedience”), the bible dictionary regarding grace and 2nd Nephi 25:23. Fundamentally, I believe we teach this doctrine incorrectly in the church.

We are saved and exalted through Grace! There, that’s all that needs to be said about Grace. But, of course I’ll say more. Grace is a gift, it can only be received not earned, bartered for or legitimized through our works. We do not work to secure grace; rather we work to show our acceptance of it. When we say, it is after all we can do. What is being explained is that after all we have done we will discover that it was God’s grace that saved us and made us whole, not our works. We need to learn to be better receivers of God’s grace and not earners of it. Isn’t it amazing that one of the first principles we are exposed to when we become members of this church is the principle of receiving, “And I say unto you, receive the Holy Ghost”. Of course as my good friend once pointed out, “How can you expect Mormons to be able to receive such great gifts from God like grace and the Holy Ghost when they can’t even receive a compliment from one another”. So what should the proper orientation to this principle (Grace) be? First, recognize the gift, second, receive/accept the gift and third, show your gratitude for the gift through your faith and good works. What is the wrong orientation to this principle? First, work as hard as you can, second, hope you have done enough to lure grace from God and third, hold your breath on judgment day.

If I was to re-write the third article of faith it would say, “We believe that all men are saved through the grace of Jesus Christ and we demonstrate our acceptance of the Lord’s gift through our faith and good works”

So what is Grace? Simply stated it is God’s love to us. At the end of the day, even though we possess priesthood, perform ordinances and do great works, God’s Grace is ultimately responsible for all that we are and all that we accomplish. It was through His grace and love that the opportunity for good works and faith is made possible. Even if we do everything just right in this life (impossible) or wrong we are still beholding to God because He is the one that made that moment possible. Our responsibility is to recognize His grace and show our acceptance and gratitude of it through our faith, love and good works. When we try to work to earn God’s grace/love we only demonstrate our self centered, ego-centric arrogance. To try to explain Grace in terms of Grace/Plus or Grace/and or Grace/but only deflects our opportunity to receive and show God our gratitude for the marvelous gifts He has given us. Maybe one day Mormons will be able to say to their non-member friends and themselves, “I am saved and exalted through God’s grace” and really believe it, in the mean time we will continue to hear many grace/plus doctrines from the pulpit that only try to contrast us with other religions and not necessarily help to define us as believers and receivers of God’s love. We need not be afraid of receiving God’s gift and proclaiming as such.

Second, isn’t the idea of “progress” and “progression” just your pet interpretation of Mormon doctrine? Honestly, where’s the scriptural evidence for your interpretation?

(1) How do you “know”, “God will not tolerate the mentality that “I can do this bad thing this week and repent and still go to church on Sunday like everything is fine.”"

Honestly, how do you “know” that? I’d like to “know” god’s will.

(2) “Thankfully, God makes these judgment calls and He is all-knowing and wise.”
I call “cop-out” on this one. By the standards of Mormonism, if someone is worthy to go through the temple, they are worthy to go to the Celestial Kingdom. Ergo, my hypothetical death-bed repenter is Celestial Kingdom bound.

(3) You’re welcome to disagree about sin being a social construction, but the evidence is not on your side. Cannibalism was a common cultural practice in New Guinea for thousands of years. The natives who lived there felt no guilt for killing and eating other people. Billions of people around the world every day drink coffee and fell zero guilt as a result. But if you were to drink it, you would feel guilty. Why? Because you believe it is a sin. In your mind, it has been socially constructed as a sin. Sin is a social construct, designed by religions to justify their existence. There is no evidence of a “light of Christ.” Additionally, there are very few things that are universally right or wrong (there probably are some, but not many). Most “bad” things are contextually bad – killing isn’t always bad, just bad sometimes; sex isn’t always bad, just bad sometimes, etc.

Megan, you don’t “know” Christ suffered for our sins. You believe that. You don’t “know” your repentance will be accepted, you believe that. You can only truly “know” something when you can share that knowledge with someone else and they can “know” it as well. Ergo, I “know” the sun comes up in the east, and so do 6 billion other people – it can be verified outside of me. I don’t “know” that there was a Jesus and I don’t believe there was. Unless you can provide evidence, solid, irrefutable evidence that there was a Jesus, you are claiming to know what is not knowable. It’s like me claiming, “I know Zeus lives on Mt. Olympus and watches over me.” Do I “know” that, Megan, or do I believe it?

Thankfully, God makes these judgment calls and He is all-knowing and wise. He will be as fair as He can, judging by intents as well as actions, unlike man, who can only judge by what he sees outwardly (strictly the actions). There’s something to be said for doing the right thing, but even if you’re doing the right thing for the wrong reason, is it really a “good” thing? Only an omniscient God can sort that out!

As for sin being merely a social construction created by religion, well, that I completely disagree with. There is a universal “right” and “wrong”. All men and women who have ever lived are given the light of Christ, or a conscience. You feel guilty when you do something bad. It doesn’t matter if you’re religious or not, you can tell when something doesn’t feel right in your soul. Do it enough and that guilt will go away, that’s true. That doesn’t change the nature of the action from bad to good.

I know Christ suffered for our sins. I know my repentance will be accepted because of His sacrifice, or grace, provided that my repentance is genuine and I am truly trying to follow Him. Beyond that, I have faith that He will judge righteously for myself and for all mankind who has ever lived.

And what about grace? Isn’t the whole idea of sin a social construction made up by religions to justify their existence?